OSX Mountain Lion Anyone?

[Helveticum]

Apple and MS are in different categories and do not compare. Pricing strategy of MS is build around functionality for their target groups (and a very flexible model), business model of Apple is build around bundling everything into a very isolated package and retailing it, pushing users for the full upgrades instead of modular ones. What you perceive as Apple taking better care in the past was probably just their lack of procedures in the software market sales. They're fixing it now, no worries

P.S. it also shouldn't worry you as a consumer what MS charges for their server editions, exchange etc

 

[BazC]

I'm not going to be drawn in to another Apple/MS argument, I've foolishly engaged in them many times on many forums and I've learned one thing no-one ever convinces the person they are having the discussion with. You asked for my views and I gave them whether or not you think they are valid is entirely up to you.

Personally I'll take an Apple computer over a Windows one any day and that's a comparison so clearly they do compare Sadly my preference is weakening however.

 

[Helveticum]

There wasn't a slightest, most remote hint of apple/ms argument, I was comparing their business models, not computers. I'm using MBP by the way.
Also, there's no such thing as Windows computer Windows is an operating system and can be installed on a Mac or vice versa.

 

[mattyb240]

2k? What config is that? Not even Retina ones seem to retail at that price.. But yeah, that's something you should expect with a 6y.o. laptop.

Not a laptop, it's the desktop/tower. The whole point of a tower is that it's supposed to be upgradeable and have a long life.

I don't agree it's inevitable with a six year old machine, it's a 64bit Intel machine and perfectly capable of running the latest version of OSX if Apple was prepared to allow it. Hell it'll run Windows 7. My old G3 and G4 machines only became obsolete when Apple switched to Intel processors and even then they were still supported for a few versions of OSX. It doesn't really fit in with Apple's marketing of the longevity of their machines either! Nope this is purely to get me to buy a new computer and it's left a sour taste in my mouth.

Intel don't even support your processors anymore, it's a great system and you have upgradability. So you can't run mountain lion so what? As you say it's not obsolete. And I think technically your wrong that apple won't allow it. Your system has a 64bit processor but a 32 bit kernel doesn't it?

Cost is irrelevant for how much you payed for the machine stuff ages, a BMW is more expensive than a ford? Will they both last the same amount of time? Will one break down before the other?

Out of curiosity where do they market the longevity? Stuff moves forward, technology, innovation, if they supported every machine out there it would be bloated as hell you may as well call it XP (I did like xp). And hell most people upgrade by the time your machine is that old, in raw data and statistics my iMac is twice as fast as your machine now.

You have a server grade power house, which is awesome, I can't upgrade now really apart from the ram but I'm happy with that for my needs. But why do you need mountain lion? Why does this mean you have to buy a new machine? Aren't you happy with your system as is? Or is it the lure of shiny latest and greatest? (not meant as a dig I'm just curios).

---

Just great after sales service, friendly knowledgeable staff. Trusting their customers - even when you were supposed to have one copy of OSX for every computer you used they never checked up on it, no registration system for the OS or most of their software. Just less hassle generally. If I want to install Windows I have to jump through hoops and sign my life away in order for MS to let me run it and woe betide me if I have to reinstall for any reason. OS updates have always been cheap next to Windows and maintained backwards compatibility for the most part. They always used to support their old hardware as long as was practical. In the last few years though that's gone out of the Window.

My iPod touch stopped being upgradeable just 2 or 3 years after I bought it, it still worked of course just couldn't run all the latest games and software. I could still browse the web and pick up my emails. At least I could until they dropped Mobile Me and launched iCloud, now it's not compatible with that either so I can't even pick up my emails any more.

Did you not switch over to the free iCloud service?? Because if you follows the instructions you could select not all my devices are compatable and still receive mail, or if you did and it hasn't worked you just need to manually set it up as an IMAP account.

Also your iPod touch is a sealed unit, it was packed with the latest tech available at the time, stuff got more demanding and technology moved forward so now the new ones are more powerful. So would you rather your old one struggle and not run anything very well? Or run what it can run well?

Apple service all products Untill a certain age, hell they still support the original iPhone as my buddy has one an needed it looked at.

 

[daz]

Why don't you all forget about lions and microsoft windoze, get yourself some Linux flavour. Forget about paying for any more software, forget about security issues and forget about software companies shafting you in places you dont like and stealing your money for upgrades that fix problems their programmers didn't spot in the first place!!!

There's a whole new world out there if you want to explore:icon_biggrin:

 

[Helveticum]

Forget about paying for any more software, forget about security issues and forget..

.. about women too :icon_razz:

 

[Wil]

I have been using Mac for about 20 years. Now on Lion (server). Will go to Mountain Lion (server) when it is available.

Mountain Lion came available yesterday, so I installed immediately (lol). The server software is now called OSX Server (was Lion Server). So far everything works just fine, installation was a piece of cake.

 

[BazC]

There wasn't a slightest, most remote hint of apple/ms argument, I was comparing their business models, not computers. I'm using MBP by the way.

Then that's where we're getting mixed up. I have no knowledge of (or interest in) their business models, I was speaking of the users experience. In the past I felt they cared about their customers, not so much any more.

Also, there's no such thing as Windows computer Windows is an operating system and can be installed on a Mac or vice versa.

Pedantry will get you nowhere a machine running Windows is a Windows computer in my book even if it's made by Apple. I'd agree there's no such thing as a Microsoft computer.

Intel don't even support your processors anymore, it's a great system and you have upgradability. So you can't run mountain lion so what? As you say it's not obsolete. And I think technically your wrong that apple won't allow it. Your system has a 64bit processor but a 32 bit kernel doesn't it?

No I believe mine has a 64bit Kernel though I'm not sure how to check, I don't think the 32bit kernel machines can run Lion as that's a fully 64bit system, mine is running it just fine. As far as I am aware if you can run Lion you should be able to run Mountain Lion aside from arbitrary restrictions.

Out of curiosity where do they market the longevity?

It's part of Apple's argument as to why you should switch from Windows to OSX, they reckon a Mac users keeps the same computer on average 3 times longer than a Windows user.

But why do you need mountain lion? Why does this mean you have to buy a new machine? Aren't you happy with your system as is? Or is it the lure of shiny latest and greatest? (not meant as a dig I'm just curios).

I don't need it, there's a few features I quite fancied but nothing vital. I also occasionally demo Macs so it's nice to keep up with the OS too.

Did you not switch over to the free iCloud service?? Because if you follows the instructions you could select not all my devices are compatable and still receive mail, or if you did and it hasn't worked you just need to manually set it up as an IMAP account.

Yup I've tried that but haven't been able to get it to work. I think it pops up a message saying I haven't entered a password even though I have.

Also your iPod touch is a sealed unit, it was packed with the latest tech available at the time, stuff got more demanding and technology moved forward so now the new ones are more powerful. So would you rather your old one struggle and not run anything very well? Or run what it can run well?

Yup that's true to a point but they could have made iCloud compatible with iOS4 - or vice versa, or they could have continued with Mobile Me - which I happily paid for either way would have worked for me. As it is my wife's Windows laptop is more compatible with iCloud than my Apple product - nice!

Anyway, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree!

Cheers!

 

[Johnus]

I still have Snow Leopard . To chg I'd have to up my memory.

 

[mattyb240]

There wasn't a slightest, most remote hint of apple/ms argument, I was comparing their business models, not computers. I'm using MBP by the way.

Then that's where we're getting mixed up. I have no knowledge of (or interest in) their business models, I was speaking of the users experience. In the past I felt they cared about their customers, not so much any more.

Also, there's no such thing as Windows computer Windows is an operating system and can be installed on a Mac or vice versa.

Pedantry will get you nowhere a machine running Windows is a Windows computer in my book even if it's made by Apple. I'd agree there's no such thing as a Microsoft computer.

Intel don't even support your processors anymore, it's a great system and you have upgradability. So you can't run mountain lion so what? As you say it's not obsolete. And I think technically your wrong that apple won't allow it. Your system has a 64bit processor but a 32 bit kernel doesn't it?

No I believe mine has a 64bit Kernel though I'm not sure how to check, I don't think the 32bit kernel machines can run Lion as that's a fully 64bit system, mine is running it just fine. As far as I am aware if you can run Lion you should be able to run Mountain Lion aside from arbitrary restrictions.

Out of curiosity where do they market the longevity?

It's part of Apple's argument as to why you should switch from Windows to OSX, they reckon a Mac users keeps the same computer on average 3 times longer than a Windows user.

But why do you need mountain lion? Why does this mean you have to buy a new machine? Aren't you happy with your system as is? Or is it the lure of shiny latest and greatest? (not meant as a dig I'm just curios).

I don't need it, there's a few features I quite fancied but nothing vital. I also occasionally demo Macs so it's nice to keep up with the OS too.

Did you not switch over to the free iCloud service?? Because if you follows the instructions you could select not all my devices are compatable and still receive mail, or if you did and it hasn't worked you just need to manually set it up as an IMAP account.

Yup I've tried that but haven't been able to get it to work. I think it pops up a message saying I haven't entered a password even though I have.

Also your iPod touch is a sealed unit, it was packed with the latest tech available at the time, stuff got more demanding and technology moved forward so now the new ones are more powerful. So would you rather your old one struggle and not run anything very well? Or run what it can run well?

Yup that's true to a point but they could have made iCloud compatible with iOS4 - or vice versa, or they could have continued with Mobile Me - which I happily paid for either way would have worked for me. As it is my wife's Windows laptop is more compatible with iCloud than my Apple product - nice!

Anyway, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree!

Cheers!

I've sent you a PM with an article for your phone. I hope you didn't take my long messages in the wrong way, I've just never ever seen apple use the length of ownership as a marketing point. Most people upgrade 2-4 years in my experience, but a Mac Pro Definately is one of those ones which will last years and years.

I'm pretty sure it has got a 32 bit kernel which lion can run despite being a 64bit system. So yes it's a shame but I don't think there trying to make you upgrade

All the best,

Matt

 

[BazC]

Thanks a lot for the link, my mail is now working again on my iPod, cheers mate!

 

[jaycey]

Well the only thing I have had time to try out so far is the Airplay mirroring which was the thing I was most looking forward to.
I had problems with Quicktime whilst playing a .avi film. It either wouldnt play or stuttered alot. I changed to VLC Player and the problem is resolved

This on it's own makes it all worth while, although I would have preffered iTunes becoming compatible with avi's but problem solved.
No more having to convert films to MP4 etc to be able to watch them over airplay to apple tv.
So far so good.

 

[shrink]

I still have Snow Leopard . To chg I'd have to up my memory.

don't concern yourself. This new lion update is a waste of time IMHO. I've stuck with snow leopard on my 2011 i5 macbook as the later releases have left me underwhelmed.

1) i don't want my desktop to behave like an IOS device
2) i don't want to have to go back in and change all the settings for scrolling etc that lion changes for you.
3) newest versions have stability / safari / wireless issues
4) some users report slowness.
5) once you disable all the glitzy nonsense, and get it working like it should, its just the same as any other mac OS since 1999. This is a glorified service pack, and not a very good one.

I've been a mac faithful for about 8 years now, but its likely i'll not bother upgrading this current machine and will probably replace it with one of the new generation of windows notebooks that finally have macbook type build quality.

 

[mattyb240]

Just to update I actually meant 32bit EFI not kernel doh!!

Had some wireless issues with lion till a software update came out, but my system is screaming so much faster than with loin now ML is on there. Plus gestures is nice I'm one of the few who like intertia scrolling.

Some PC laptops have Definately upped there game in terms of build quality. Snow leopard was/is awesome, if you see these as service packs then there is no reason to upgrade. But windows holds onto OS's far longer than Apple, so it doesn't make your system obsolete all of a sudden?

With all respect how many is "some users" I've had no problems and neither have my friends? Do we class as some? So some work and some not so well? Do a clean install and you will be pleasantly surprised im sure and probably won't have "some" issues. This place is as good as any, some hate derby blades, some not so much so who is telling the truth?

 

[Audiolab]

Finished ripping my DVD's at the weekend and downloaded a copy of ML.

We just moved to Fibre to the cabinet in my rural area (21CN) and now with an LLU provider and I am getting amazingly fast speeds at the same sync speed. I am a decent distance from the exchange, maybe just under 2KM and normally still get about 8Kb sync speeds but it pulled down the 4Gb in under an hour and a half, seems sync speed is only half the tale.

I have not installed ML yet. Like Shrink I hate reconfiguring but I completed so many different education courses in the last 12 months which required manual edits of kext files and tweaks to other config files I would like to start again with a clean slate with just what I use now. for the sake of £12 I will risk the new OS but for me it has to be a format the drive job with no import from time machine.

Reading MacRumors and other sites this version is like the Vista to Windows 7. In essence they are the same OS but this is much more refined and does not suffer from the wi-fi and other bugs that appeared with Lion. MacRumors is a Bit of a fanboy site but others seem to conform this assertion, it is Lion as it should have been.....but we shall see.

Having said that I would not buy a new MacBook with the Retina Display until they prove to have got the product stable, seen too many reports of image retention on the screens and I like having an optical drive. For my early 2011 model this O/S carries a number of improvements and I guess potentially a number of new bugs but overall it seems like a worth upgrade especially if you have a device that supports airplay (check first as a lot have jumped in expecting airplay when they hardware is just not there to support it).

I will report back on how it goes on my machine in case anyone is considering it, and lucky me handbrake is now compatible.

 

[mattyb240]

Hand break is awesome! Why won't you import from time machine? If you don't want to do a complete restore just use migration assistant in the OS and pick what you want to come across much easier and can exclude your library by not importing your user account or choosing the folder you want.