If you've used a slant, what are your observations?

[Leisureguy]

@PickledNorthern In another forum I'm in a discussion about slants—and that discussion stimulated this post. In that discussion, I listed a number of reasons a man might have for getting a slant:
works well on tough beard with sensitive skin: performance

• lots of new slants available: novelty, trendiness
• lots of new slants available: where there's smoke, there's fire—it must be good
• they look weird (especially, perhaps, the 102): coolness, eccentricity
• recommended by someone trusted: the buddy factor
• most people don't use one: coolness, eccentricity

But that's the reason I phrased the poll as I did: to focus on the experience they had and not the motivation for buying (because, indeed, it may have been a gift). But I agree: there are many contributors to buying, and some, as I've noted in other contexts, are self-reinforcing—see this article, for example. The DE razor is one: it truly makes shaving better for someone, so he tells all his buddies and shows off his stuff, so some of them try it, and by God! for most it is in fact better. So they tell, and then the more people who are getting into it, it becomes increasingly trendy, and since it fulfills its promises, recidivism is relatively rare. And what is true for the DE is also true for slants, as I argue toward the end of this article. The poll the article refers to is the poll I discussed above.

 

[Whosthedaddy]

I like a slant but have found some to be too mild for my taste.

The ones that Andrea's mentioned; the Trumpf and Neo Gam were mine on the pass around and truly tick all the boxes for me.

I think I am more drawn to a torqued blade over the hump type slants like the 102 / Mulcuto.

 

[Leisureguy]

@efsk - I know about that mystic quality attributed to slants and I do everything I can to eradicate it. And that "scary" aspect: as I've written elsewhere, some razors are both "mild" (in feel: gentle on the skin) and "aggressive" (in performance: efficiently and easily removing stubble). Those are a category I discuss in the book, the "Mild-Aggressive" razors, but those terms are now so beaten up that they can't really be together—which is why I now talk about feel/comfort and performance/efficiency, each of which can be mild or aggressive: four possibilities (though razors in the uncomfortable plus inefficient quadrant tend to die quick deaths—I did have one: a 3-D printed slant).

My own recommendation is that a man's second razor, after he routinely gets comfortable, close, and trouble-free shaves, is that he get a slant to try. An adjustable, a different type of guard: those (to me) are trivial changes. Slanting the blade is a more direct change on the very thing that does the work of cutting.

But my recommendation is definitely to try it while taking note of these three pointers. Today I am going one step further: try the RazoRock German 37 head. It's just $12, it's based on a time-tested variant, and in my experience it shaves quite nicely: very comfortable, not inclined to nick if you keep the pressure light, and quite efficient. Obviously, some will not detect any difference in the shave, but then they spent only $12 (plus postage) and they can probably easily sell it on BST since slants are now trendy (see above).

 

[efsk]

Your question isn't bad, I'm just not sure you can get a real answer. I think where most classic shaving folk will have tried or will try more than one conventional DE, until recently would only try at most one slant. At which point they'll be pleasantly surprised and stick with it, or be disappointed and don't get what the fuss is all about. So most comparisons are by definition slanted (heh): 3 cars vs one motorcycle.
All the new slants will change this somewhat, but the cheap ones will skew results as well. People are put of by plastic (PAA) and suboptimal finishing (RR 37), the Maggard is too aggressive for a beginner, and the is X3 too mild and has messed up the differential aggression its model was famous for. The real good ones, ATT and Wunderbar, are either expensive, or unobtainable or both.

 

[PickledNorthern]

@efsk - I know about that mystic quality attributed to slants and I do everything I can to eradicate it.

).

I know you do, I have seen the advice you give to all the Wicked Edge newbies. No disrespect aimed at your survey at all.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Leisureguy]

Your question isn't bad, I'm just not sure you can get a real answer. I think where most classic shaving folk will have tried or will try more than one conventional DE, until recently would only try at most one slant. At which point they'll be pleasantly surprised and stick with it, or be disappointed and don't get what the fuss is all about. So most comparisons are by definition slanted (heh): 3 cars vs one motorcycle.
All the new slants will change this somewhat, but the cheap ones will skew results as well. People are put of by plastic (PAA) and suboptimal finishing (RR 37), the Maggard is too aggressive for a beginner, and the is X3 too mild and has messed up the differential aggression its model was famous for. The real good ones, ATT and Wunderbar, are either expensive, or unobtainable or both.

I actually will get a real answer: a percentage that find slants shave better for them and a percentage that does not (the same or worse). Since you list a number of reasons the slant experience would be worse with your casual condemnation of a range of razors, some of which work extremely well for some (and we've seen their reports of the experience, including my own enthusiastic report about the German 37). One thing I obviously haven't made clear: I focus primarily on feel and performance. In those categories, the German 37 seems quite good.

But in any event, you've identified a lot of ways that the initial slant experience can be bad (not a good slant for them, not willing to "throw good money after bad"). Obviously, those who found the slant shaved better avoided those pitfalls, but the inescapable conclusion is that the "no better than a conventional razor" includes some number—perhaps some signifiant number—of men who would really have enjoyed a slant greatly (if, for example, they had followed the three pointers and/or purchased a different slant). But even with the distortion that induces, there currently seems to be about a 50-50 chance that if you try a slant you'll find you get a better shave. That's good to know.

And FWIW, I find the X3 extremely mild in feel (almost no blade feel) but highly efficient in performance. YMMV, of course: people differ.

 

[efsk]

And that "scary" aspect: as I've written elsewhere, some razors are both "mild" (in feel: gentle on the skin) and "aggressive" (in performance: efficiently and easily removing stubble). Those are a category I discuss in the book, the "Mild-Aggressive" razors, but those terms are now so beaten up that they can't really be together—which is why I now talk about feel/comfort and performance/efficiency, each of which can be mild or aggressive:

True. I rate efficiency and aggressiveness, where aggressiveness is basically: how easy is it to hurt yourself with it, either cuts or irritation. This leads to misunderstandings since aggressive has different meanings to dfferent people.

(though razors in the uncomfortable plus inefficient quadrant tend to die quick deaths—I did have one: a 3-D printed slant).

Which one is that? I've three 3Dprinted slants, and find all three efficient, and one uncomfortable: the Kraken. Mayur (drone115b, the creator of this slant) advised using it with a Feather-blade for better results but I haven't tried that yet.

But my recommendation is definitely to try it while taking note of these three pointers. Today I am going one step further: try the RazoRock German 37 head. It's just $12, it's based on a time-tested variant, and in my experience it shaves quite nicely: very comfortable, not inclined to nick if you keep the pressure light, and quite efficient. Obviously, some will not detect any difference in the shave, but then they spent only $12 (plus postage) and they can probably easily sell it on BST since slants are now trendy (see above).

I have a bit of a problem with all the Merkur-based slants coming to market now. Basing a slant on a no longer produced vintage model, or recreating that model, yes please. I'm still waiting for someone to base a slant on the Apollo's. Basically taking someone elses still in production razor seems not right, regardless of legality. Should the by now four (!) razormakers copying the Merkurhead pay licensingfees to Merkur I will retract this complaint.

 

[efsk]

your casual condemnation of a range of razors

I don't condemn them, I can see where these razors MAY have a negative effect on results, my personal opinion about these razors notwithstanding. I love the PAA and the Maggard. The X3 is very efficient but it for me is just that, and forget about the fun shaving can be. The RR37 is a very good razor, but were it part of a limited rotation, I'd get annoyed about the way I have to screw the handle on.

 

[Missoni]

@JohnnyO - When you refer to the iKon slant, do you mean the stainless head that was available plain or with a DLC coating and now with the B1 coating? or the iKon X3 (aluminum)? or the iKon 102 (also aluminum)?

@Hourwerk - I think anyone who makes anything will pay attention to marketing issues (I once did product marketing), and that can include trivia ("Exciting new colors!") as well as substantial improvements that improve the quality of the product and the customer experience. Indeed, the desire to make a product more appealing, more useful, more likely to be purchased and recommended drives a lot (most?) innovation. But as I tried to emphasize in my original post, many (including me) find that a slant that works well for them does indeed offer a noticeable improvement over even very good regular razors. I quoted one shaver who had 8 years experience with regular razors. However, as I also emphasized, nothing in shaving works for everyone, and if something doesn't work for you it's often difficult to believe reports from those for whom it does work. I still see remarks from men for whom a particular brand of blade did not work strongly recommending that others not even try that brand, and suggesting that it be removed from the sampler pack and discarded. (The "bad" brand varies from person to person.) They are unable to believe that something that doesn't work for them could possibly work for anyone else. Most, however, recognize the rule of YMMV in shaving (and in much else—comedy, for example: a comic who's hilarious for one may fall flat for another).

@Missoni - Yeah, the 39C didn't work for me either—because of the handle, not the head: the 37C works fine. Right now there are several razors using that head design, and the RazoRock German 37 uses the head in a three-piece design and sells the head separately so that you can provide a handle that you like.

@PickledNorthern - I also didn't like the 39C, but there are other slants and, just as with regular razors, some work for me and others don't. I wouldn't give up on slants because a particular model didn't work for me, any more than I would give up on DE shaving because a particular DE razor didn't work for me.

...the 39c worked well for me, it is a great shaver however after more experience with other razors I was able to better discriminate in terms of my own preferences. I prefer a small razor head and handle. The RazoRock German 37 head with shipping would be about the same price as the Merkur 37c in the UK which may lessen its appeal outside of the US; but I agree it is a good option for those that want to use their own handle.

 

[Leisureguy]

@efsk - The Merkur Slant has a patent date of 1906, as a recall, right after the English patent of 1905. Any IP protection is long since gone. And TBH Merkur hasn't done much with their safety razors, so they are being passed by. The Progress is certainly excellent (IMO), but the Vision 2000 was a flop, and I don't care for the Futur. Other vendors have been coming out with interesting stuff, even the "new" (5 years old now) Edwin Jagger head was (IMO) an advance over the Merkur Classic head.

I con't recall the name of the 3-D printed plastic slant, but I did not like it. Some of the inefficiency was doubtless because it threatened constantly to cut, so you had to shave defensively.

 

[JayGee]

I have easily irritated skin & a very tough beard.
Slants work very well for me, preferring an efficient razor that gets the job done in fewer strokes.

Plastic razors also seem to work very well, I have a 45c & a German unbranded open comb that gives a stunning shave.

If I have a blade that is a bit meh & tuggy (supermax), put it in my 39c & it tends to improve noticeably.

I'd love to try a fasan, plastic open comb & a slant, bingo.

 

[Leisureguy]

@Missoni - I agree: the German 37 head is going to be primarily of interest to those in Canada and the US. However, I would hope that some UK dealer might carry it (and certainly it might be suggested). It has the significant benefit of allowing you to swap handles, which (as you know) is not possible with the 39C and the 37C (otherwise you could have replaced your 39C handle).

I really like the iKon X3, and Connaught Shaving does sell the head by itself. With that you could use whatever handle you want. The X3 head is 1g lighter than the Edwin Jagger head, so the X3 head works well on an EJ handle in terms of balance.

 

[Ferrum]

I've got 6 slants - 3 Ikons/Shavecraft (102, X3, and an uncoated stainless model), ATT with both plates S1/S2, the Fine miniature plastic, and the Razorock black aluminium V3. Of these, the ATT and the Shavecrafts are the best for me, the Fine I've used once but, though it works OK, it's really too small for anything other than a good little travel razor; and the Razorock, in common with the stainless Ikon, is a bit bulky in the head and not especially efficient.

Speaking very generally, I find the slants more efficient than a limited number of older Gillettes, and perhaps some non-slant Merkurs; but not really much better than the new breeds of DE razor. They don't outshine Blackland, Wolfman, Timeless, ATT, Rocnel or Barbaros, all of which will deliver near-perfect results every time when teamed with the "right" blade, and particularly, where it's an option, supplied with a blade gap that suits the individual.

I've been considering this question as solely concerning DE razors. It's probably an unfair "apples and pears" comparison, but many DEs, slant or otherwise, have, in my opinion, a hard time keeping up with SE razors; old ones like PALs, and newer like Mongoose, Single Edge, Rocnel SE-50 etc.

 

[Fuzzyian]

I love my 39c, gives a great shave, but it's not better than say an R41, I am not sure that they can compare, a razor either works for you or it doesn't.

 

[Leisureguy]

@Ferrum - I certainly agree that some modern conventional razors are a delight: very mild and comfortable on the skin, not inclined to nick, and highly efficient at removing stubble. And it's certainly true that some slants are likely not to work well for a person (much as some regular razors won't work well for him even though others do).

Still, I (and about 50% of those responding to the poll) do find that a slant has a slight edge, as it were, in encountering less cutting resistance than razors that cut purely with compressive force—and using a shearing force to improve the cutting action is well established (cf. the Gillette slide, which can be used in the WTG pass on the cheeks, but becomes increasingly problematic as you move to other passes (XTG, ATG) and locations (chin, neck, upper lip). The slant carries the shearing action it the razor's head so it can be used everywhere.

It's obviously a slight advantage, given that 50% don't notice it, but it's obviously there, both from theory (blade is slanted) and practice (50% can detect it).

I find the X3 and 102 best, with S1 close behind. (S2 was too harsh for me.) The V3 is (for me) just as good and despite how some find the large head too bulky to use, I've not found it to be a problem, not even on the upper lip (which is the focus of most complaints, though I've already read complaints from those who dislike the handle position (handle close to face) which they find makes shaving the neck difficult: the handle is fairly long and the bottom of the handle pokes them as they try to shave under the jawline on the WTG pass, for example.

Blackland was too harsh for me, but Rockwell, all the iKon regular razors except the Tech and their very first razors, the ATT R1, and—surprise!—the Dorco PL-602 are all extremely comfortable and extremely efficient for me.

Yeah, I'm talking solely about DE razors because I wanted to compare a slant with a conventional razor—i.e., razors that are basically the same except for the slanted blade—and so far as I know there are no SE slants. And I'm talking about safety razors so did not bring up a straight razor or kamisori. Those of course allow for a slant, but they are really in a separate category in my view.

@Fuzzyian - It's unusual to find someone who can distinguish only whether a razor works or doesn't work. That sort of binary division fails for most because they can detect degrees of working or not working, such as "this razor is (more/less) comfortable/efficient than that one, or (more/less) efficient efficient. For example, I find that I can get a good shave with (random example) a Super Speed but the Dorco PL-602 is both more comfortable (though not by much) and more efficient. But if you find that the only differences you detect are "works" and "doesn't work," then gradations are invisible.

I think most detect a range of comfort in their razors, from flat-out uncomfortable and prone to nice to extremely comfortable and very reluctant to nick, and the same with efficiency (from inefficient to efficient). I the Guide I suggest some assignments for four categories:

Comfortable and efficient: RazoRock Baby Smooth, Dorco PL-602, Rockwell S6, Parker 24C
Uncomfortable and efficient: MÜHLE R41, iKon Shavecraft Tech
Comfortable and inefficient: Weishi, Micro One Touch, Van Der Hagen (all made by Weishi)
Uncomfortable and inefficient: Not many here, for obvious reasons, but I had a plastic 3-D printed slant that fell into this category.

 

[Fuzzyian]

@Ferrum - I certainly agree that some modern conventional razors are a delight: very mild and comfortable on the skin, not inclined to nick, and highly efficient at removing stubble. And it's certainly true that some slants are likely not to work well for a person (much as some regular razors won't work well for him even though others do).

Still, I (and about 50% of those responding to the poll) do find that a slant has a slight edge, as it were, in encountering less cutting resistance than razors that cut purely with compressive force—and using a shearing force to improve the cutting action is well established (cf. the Gillette slide, which can be used in the WTG pass on the cheeks, but becomes increasingly problematic as you move to other passes (XTG, ATG) and locations (chin, neck, upper lip). The slant carries the shearing action it the razor's head so it can be used everywhere.

It's obviously a slight advantage, given that 50% don't notice it, but it's obviously there, both from theory (blade is slanted) and practice (50% can detect it).

I find the X3 and 102 best, with S1 close behind. (S2 was too harsh for me.) The V3 is (for me) just as good and despite how some find the large head too bulky to use, I've not found it to be a problem, not even on the upper lip (which is the focus of most complaints, though I've already read complaints from those who dislike the handle position (handle close to face) which they find makes shaving the neck difficult: the handle is fairly long and the bottom of the handle pokes them as they try to shave under the jawline on the WTG pass, for example.

Blackland was too harsh for me, but Rockwell, all the iKon regular razors except the Tech and their very first razors, the ATT R1, and—surprise!—the Dorco PL-602 are all extremely comfortable and extremely efficient for me.

Yeah, I'm talking solely about DE razors because I wanted to compare a slant with a conventional razor—i.e., razors that are basically the same except for the slanted blade—and so far as I know there are no SE slants. And I'm talking about safety razors so did not bring up a straight razor or kamisori. Those of course allow for a slant, but they are really in a separate category in my view.

@Fuzzyian - It's unusual to find someone who can distinguish only whether a razor works or doesn't work. That sort of binary division fails for most because they can detect degrees of working or not working, such as "this razor is (more/less) comfortable/efficient than that one, or (more/less) efficient efficient. For example, I find that I can get a good shave with (random example) a Super Speed but the Dorco PL-602 is both more comfortable (though not by much) and more efficient. But if you find that the only differences you detect are "works" and "doesn't work," then gradations are invisible.

I think most detect a range of comfort in their razors, from flat-out uncomfortable and prone to nice to extremely comfortable and very reluctant to nick, and the same with efficiency (from inefficient to efficient). I the Guide I suggest some assignments for four categories:

Comfortable and efficient: RazoRock Baby Smooth, Dorco PL-602, Rockwell S6, Parker 24C
Uncomfortable and efficient: MÜHLE R41, iKon Shavecraft Tech
Comfortable and inefficient: Weishi, Micro One Touch, Van Der Hagen (all made by Weishi)
Uncomfortable and inefficient: Not many here, for obvious reasons, but I had a plastic 3-D printed slant that fell into this category.

You misunderstood what I said, my fault for not explaining, what I said was that you can tell between different razors, but what you can't tell is if it's the slant of the razor that makes the difference, or is it because it is a different razor, and the only way to find out the difference would be to have a razor which has all the same dimensions but one was a slant and the other is not.