7 day set on eBay for £1200: pure madness?

[ferroburak]

There's a seller of ivory scales on the American forum the straight razor place, and they are very reasonably priced, and I would have purchased quite a few sets, but It's totally illegal to import or rework Ivory in the UK, and you are miles away price wise, as ivory is far more affordable than you think, trouble being you can't rework or import it, but we do have huge stocks in the UK of vintage ivory but it's exported to other countries. just take a look at one of many suppliers in the USA, http://www.elephantivorytusks.com/elivbasl.html

Around 500 usd for handle blanks only, and it does not look nearly as white as the one on the razors. Then one will have to shape it to razor handle shape. The material is probably harder than untempered steel. Good luck..

 

[Halk]

I did a bit of googling and found out a couple of interesting things - apologies if this was already widely known to everybody apart from me!

Mammoth ivory is legal, and can be freely bought, people dig it up in Siberia and sell it. Morally there's no issue.
There are other legal ivories - hippo used to be legal until recently, but has been banned. The hippo ivory trade was not pleasant.
Elephant ivory can only be sold if it's "worked", it cannot be reworked, and while it's legal to own unworked ivory it cannot be sold on and it needs to come from before WW2, approx.
Boar tusks are legal, however it may be the case that hippo ivory is listed as boar tusk as a euphemism to get around laws.

 

[pugh-the-special-one]

There's a seller of ivory scales on the American forum the straight razor place, and they are very reasonably priced, and I would have purchased quite a few sets, but It's totally illegal to import or rework Ivory in the UK, and you are miles away price wise, as ivory is far more affordable than you think, trouble being you can't rework or import it, but we do have huge stocks in the UK of vintage ivory but it's exported to other countries. just take a look at one of many suppliers in the USA, http://www.elephantivorytusks.com/elivbasl.html

Around 500 usd for handle blanks only, and it does not look nearly as white as the one on the razors. Then one will have to shape it to razor handle shape. The material is probably harder than untempered steel. Good luck..

What on earth are you talking about $72 dollars about £40. ?

 

[jaycey]

Might be a bit of old bone?
They look unused?

Nice set, I would hone them and use them. But not at half the asking price.

 

[ferroburak]

There's a seller of ivory scales on the American forum the straight razor place, and they are very reasonably priced, and I would have purchased quite a few sets, but It's totally illegal to import or rework Ivory in the UK, and you are miles away price wise, as ivory is far more affordable than you think, trouble being you can't rework or import it, but we do have huge stocks in the UK of vintage ivory but it's exported to other countries. just take a look at one of many suppliers in the USA, http://www.elephantivorytusks.com/elivbasl.html

Around 500 usd for handle blanks only, and it does not look nearly as white as the one on the razors. Then one will have to shape it to razor handle shape. The material is probably harder than untempered steel. Good luck..

What on earth are you talking about $72 dollars about £40. ?

Multiply by 7. That one is also a bit short. It is hard, brittle stuff cannot be machined. Razors are beautiful, a lot of work. Check my previous posts if need be.

 

[Mikael]

Might be a bit of old bone?
They look unused?

Nice set, I would hone them and use them. But not at half the asking price.

I agree, they do look unused and very nice, in my eyes... I stand by my valuation, would prob sell for around asking price, if auctioned out. I would love to use one of those, M&W are most often excellent razors, in my experience.

 

[pugh-the-special-one]

I think this link will more than justify my costing of these razors, I see Mappin and Webb razors in really nice condition with ivory handles on a regular basis pop up all the time and this is another one you can buy it now for £61 and there are many seven day sets of these razor that also occasionally come up for auction and fetch nowhere near those kind of prices. check out the link.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Mappin-Webb-Trustworthy-Razor-Sheffield-England-/160905290043?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2576b3e13b

Jamie.

 

[Mikael]

I think this link will more than justify my costing of these razors, I see Mappin and Webb razors in really nice condition with ivory handles on a regular basis pop up all the time and this is another one you can buy it now for £61 and there are many seven day sets of these razor that also occasionally come up for auction and fetch nowhere near those kind of prices. check out the link.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Mappin-Webb-Trustworthy-Razor-Sheffield-England-/160905290043?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2576b3e13b

Jamie.

I'm sorry Jamie, but did you really check the pics on that razor?

 

[pugh-the-special-one]

I did Mikael and that razor looks every bit as good as anyone of those 7 day set and with a light restore that razor could look like new, you can google Mappin and Webb on a weekly basis and you will see the true value of those razors, there's a 6 day boxed set on Ebay right now I would watch it if I really were that interested in seeing what a boxed set go for. here's a link to the 6 day set, he states the handles are some kind of bone, but they look ivory, but i'm sure he knows this but If he stated this he would have to remove the listing.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OLD-LEATHER-CASED-SET-OF-SIX-DAYS-OF-THE-WEEK-RAZORS-MAPPIN-WEBB-/150932022148?pt=UK_Collectables_Barber_Shop_Collectables_LE&hash=item23243fe384

Jamie

 

[Mikael]

I will write nothing more about this.

 

[Old blade grinder]

Mappin and Web silver smiths of Sheffield they however put their brand name on other things like razors I just can't rember who made there razors but £1200 for a set with damage no but if you look at the price for new high end cutthroats they look cheap at only £171 each with a free box

 

[Neil Miller]

Quoting US prices and then converting them to UK sterling is twaddle in my opinion - auctions excepted, because auction prices are atypical. The asking price for non-auction items that are available from the same source both in the US and the UK bear no comparison with auction prices - one only has to buy a few things a year to notice that the US asking price is about the same as the UK one with the currency notation changed - ie 99 US becomes 99 UK.

This is so for most of the things that I have imported from the US going back to 2001: cameras, camera parts, lighters, pukka jewellers tools, silver nitrate, collodion, azo paper, contact wheels for belt grinders, abrasive belts and much, much more. I can't be the only one to notice the phenomenon. Auction prices are exceptions because they are 'freak' values - they are only valid at the time of the sale and have little to do with the true intrinsic worth of the item, only what the highest bidder at that time is willing to pay. And then there is the dreaded VAT bill should customs get the packet, plus handling fee, which applies to both auction and non-auction items from the US.

As for Mappin & Webb razors, I have had many and still have a few boxed sets and single examples. Not one of them cost me as little as £61 - indeed, I would be suspicious of one going so cheaply.

The history of Mappin Bros / Mappin & Webb should be well known by most - at least those who attempt to value their razors (obviously). Briefly, the company started in 1774/5 and was achieving prominence at the time Joseph Mappin became a Freeman of the Cutlers Company (1787 - Jos. Mappin & Son). One of Joseph's sons made a fortune in brewing and art, the other went with razor-maker George Arundel (1820s - Arundel & Mappin). Frederick Mappin (who underwent his apprenticeship) was head of the firm in 1839 when they were advertised as manufacturers of razors and other fine cutlery. William Sansom & Co , Cutlers to the King, were absorbed by Mappins in 1845. In 1851 the Queens Plate & Cutlery Works was opened. Queens Works was one of the largest cutlery works in Sheffield. The name came from their royal appointment to Queen Victoria. London showrooms were opened in 1856.

So - they had their own workshops, they employed their own cutlers and they made their own razors.

A well-appointed, non messed-about or tarted-up original M&W is worth well over a hundred quid any day of the week in my estimation.

We all have our own opinions, however ill-founded they are, and these are mine. Like Mikael, I have nothing else to say on the subject either.

Regards,
Neil

 

[pmorris4562]

A pal of mine had a 1950s Bendix washing machine that had only acted as a spin dryer for years. He asked me to help him take it to the tip. I stuck it on Ebay for a start price of £5, bidder to collect. It sold for £235.

So you never know!

I had a similar experience with a Hetchins bike frame which came out of a skip. It made £300 on ebay, even though it needed totally stripping and re-finishing. My only regret is that it was far too big for me, otherwise I'd have kept it myself, as I've always wanted one. :icon_sad:

 

[UKRob]

Out of interest I followed the original link and, according to the page, they sold for £1,195.

 

[pugh-the-special-one]

I also followed another Ebay sale of a 7 day set of Mappin & Webb which in my opinion were a better set condition wise except for the case and they sold for £107 now I'm thinking my valuation was in the right ball park all along. here they are. And the listing for the other set said listing ended not sold.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OLD-LEATHER-CASED-SET-OF-SIX-DAYS-OF-THE-WEEK-RAZORS-MAPPIN-WEBB-/150932022148?pt=UK_Collectables_Barber_Shop_Collectables_LE&hash=item23243fe384&nma=true&si=dHOD013lVk4DpvRGKOhA8G2pxsg%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557


Jamie

 

[Neil Miller]

Utter twaddle. Just goes to show what 'opinions' are worth - they vary as widely as the prices on Ebay. Assigning price by sales at auctions is sheer folly, as anybody who has seen any of the hoard of antiques progs on British TV will be able to tell you. If two or more people want the item on the day it will bring a fair price - if nobody wants it it will not. Obvious? I would have thought so.

Now, what event is looming up that might affect prices - oh yeah - xmas. Everyone spends a bundle on themselves just before christmas, don't they? I don't think so....

That set consists of six razors, not seven.

Two sets of scales have severe cracks at the pivot or wedge and are therefore useless.

One of the blades has a large bit out of it.

Every set of scales is heavily stained with over-oiling at the pivot that has traveled deep into the ivory, making it look dirty. Rust has also discoloured the ivory from the inside. This won't be remedied by a simple sanding job.

Every blade is rusted at the pivot, along the jimps of the tang both top and bottom, and the scales will have to be un-pinned to address this properly - unless you are into scrimping on the job, which I, personally, am not.

There is heavy rusting on the face side of two of the tangs, which when removed will take the makers mark off.

The surface of each blade has light rust marks and a patina formed of mere surface oxide plus deeper watermarks and pitting, although the shine is good the tarnish has to go. Once again it is a surface grinding that is required, starting at around 320 grit, then 440 - 600 - 800 - 1000, followed by abrasive buffing and polishing. Even then some of the marks will remain.

Once unpinned/repinned, scales cleaned, tarnish, rust and pitting removed and brought back to a shine, bevel re-set and honed to shave-ready - each razor that survives will cost more than the buying price of the original six.

That's the primary reason for the low price - 'people in the know' know that a lot of work is required.

How do I know the condition so intimately? I have the set in front of me for restoration. Add the cost of restoration onto the buying price, then you get somewhere near the real - not notional 'ballpark' price.

Regards,
Neil

PS Thanks to all those who have wished me well - I'm very humbled by some of the kind comments I have received, both by PM, email and on this forum. Thanks guys. I am up for short periods now and doing OK, albeit with a very colourful and excruciatingly painful leg. My wife keeps telling me to go back to bed or it will get chopped off, but hey - losing a few pounds before xmas is always a good thing, right?!