coffee setup?

Big.Dave

Big.Dave

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Ok I've started drinking coffee
why well I have discovered it takes the same amount of time as tea but if its a espresso type less time to drink because the small shot cools more quickly so suits me.

So I'm looking at a setup that I can make espresso and if I have a few guests nock up a moka pot of coffee.

For making espresso I'm looking at a la pavoni pro lever machine because I have used £10,000 commercial bean to cup machines and they are a PITA if they go wrong and I've seen a fair few go U/S. The la pavoni is very simple design (less to go wrong I maybe able to fix my self) and as for a grinder a kitchenaid pro line artisan grinder because I have used kitchenaid mixers and even the baby ones are built like brick out houses.

I have also read on line that the kitchenaid grinder can be modded to become step less (I'm not sure what that means) and the Burrs can be changed with some drilling and tapping to those of a mazzer grinder which I hear are very good machines but cost mega bucks.

So what do you guys think to this set up.

I think is gives me something to play with.
 
Avoid the kitchenaid grinder like the plague. The burrs are rubbish for espresso; they will not grind fine or consistently enough. I have first hand experience at that. An entry level grinder would be an Ibertal MC2. A step up from that would be a Eureka Mignon and then you're into Mazzers which are £500+ when new. You could consider second hand.

However, buying into espresso is hugely expensive in money and time. You could call Claudette at Bella Barista (not on Saturdays) for advice. Most of us who have got into espresso bought cheap and bought twice: I've had three grinders (Kitchenaid; Macap stepped & Mazzer) and three machines (kitchen aid - 2 weeks; Quickmill Andreja - 6 years; Cremina - 2 years)

Paul
 
p.b said:
Avoid the kitchenaid grinder like the plague. The burrs are rubbish for espresso; they will not grind fine or consistently enough. I have first hand experience at that. An entry level grinder would be an Ibertal MC2. A step up from that would be a Eureka Mignon and then you're into Mazzers which are £500+ when new. You could consider second hand.

However, buying into espresso is hugely expensive in money and time. You could call Claudette at Bella Barista (not on Saturdays) for advice. Most of us who have got into espresso bought cheap and bought twice: I've had three grinders (Kitchenaid; Macap stepped & Mazzer) and three machines (kitchen aid - 2 weeks; Quickmill Andreja - 6 years; Cremina - 2 years)

Paul
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Thanks.

I do have one question with reference to the Kitchenaid grinder have you tried any of the mods like replacing the Burrs with the ones from a Mazzer?
 
I have a La Pavoni Pro lever that is in use almost daily.

There's a reason why there are so many La Pav Euros and Pros are on fleabay and that is they are very grind and even bean specific so it's difficult for the average Joe to get good extraction. It's usually only fine for 1 or 2 cups...anymore than that and temp control goes out the window.

They are bulletproof though so I would buy a second hand Pro (easy to recondition) and put the money into a much much better grinder, you'll need it for the Pro.

BTW I have a Mazzer...don't skimp.
 
antdad said:
I have a La Pavoni Pro lever that is in use almost daily.

There's a reason why there are so many La Pav Euros and Pros are on fleabay and that is they are very grind and even bean specific so it's difficult for the average Joe to get good extraction. It's usually only fine for 1 or 2 cups...anymore than that and temp control goes out the window.

They are bulletproof though so I would buy a second hand Pro (easy to recondition) and put the money into a much much better grinder, you'll need it for the Pro.

BTW I have a Mazzer...don't skimp.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the reply the la Pavoni's sound like just what I'm looking for I only drink 2 maybe 3 espressos a day so sounds like it is suited to me. I liked your comments about there being lots on fleabay because the average joe struggles to get a good cup. I'm hoping to be at an advantage because taste and flavour is what I do for a living now for the past 26 years working as a chef. In that time I have learned that it is impossible to make one dish of food that everybody likes but it is possible to change it so the don't like it's like it.

As for the grinder I've changed my mind about the kitchenaid one, on paper it looks good grinds to industry standards but I came across a page on the web where a guy had brought one second hand and it had a problem he opened up where the gearing was and found that it was all made of plastic!

I'm now looking at a Eureka mignon any thoughts on that would be greatly appreciated. To me it looks simple and the chrome one looks like it would go nicely with a Pavoni.

Ooh one more La Pavoni question why do you recommend a pro over a Europiccola?
 
I started on the coffee road about 6 months ago. After much research I bought an Iberital MC2 Auto grinder. Once dialled in it is great, takes some time getting it set right, but once it is its excellent. I also bought a Gaggia Classic which is probably one of the cheapest proper Espresso machines about. With this set up the coffee I make at home is better than most coffee available on the high street, specialist coffee shops like Monmouth excepted.
I would happily recommend this kit.
 
Big.Dave said:
I'm hoping to be at an advantage because taste and flavour is what I do for a living now for the past 26 years working as a chef. In that time I have learned that it is impossible to make one dish of food that everybody likes but it is possible to change it so the don't like it's like it.
Click to expand...

I'm sure you have a highly tuned sense of taste but what makes you a good chef is consistency. What I meant is the Euro/Pro is extremely finicky and it is far from easy to get consistent results especially as a novice, that's why folks give up on them. I bought one as a curiosity and grew to like it but it still took me ages to become proficient even though I think I know what I'm doing. I can and do still produce terrible and great shots in equal measure, it's like the espresso machine equivalent of a shavette.

I'd go with the setup LtB recommends, it's tried and tested and prosumer machines like the Classic and Silvia are dead easy to maintain. The Eureka looks splendid if you want to spend that much on a grinder it'll be a sound investment. Spend a bit more time reading the coffee forums, there is good reason why La Pav Euro/Pros are never recommended but if you insist the Pro has a bigger boiler and pressure gauge which is very useful.
 
I've got a classic and a macap m4 grinder. The classic has been a great place to cut my teeth. You can make great espresso with it. It's relatively simple inside and there's plenty of mods if you want to fiddle with it. Most change the steam wand to a silvia one. I've also adjusted the pressure and fitted a PID to help with temperature control. These aren't essential changes but I've quite enjoyed taking the lid off. You can pick one up second hand and loose very little money when you come to sell it on.
 
antdad said:
Big.Dave said:
I'm hoping to be at an advantage because taste and flavour is what I do for a living now for the past 26 years working as a chef. In that time I have learned that it is impossible to make one dish of food that everybody likes but it is possible to change it so the don't like it's like it.
Click to expand...

I'm sure you have a highly tuned sense of taste but what makes you a good chef is consistency. What I meant is the Euro/Pro is extremely finicky and it is far from easy to get consistent results especially as a novice, that's why folks give up on them. I bought one as a curiosity and grew to like it but it still took me ages to become proficient even though I think I know what I'm doing. I can and do still produce terrible and great shots in equal measure, it's like the espresso machine equivalent of a shavette.

I'd go with the setup LtB recommends, it's tried and tested and prosumer machines like the Classic and Silvia are dead easy to maintain. The Eureka looks splendid if you want to spend that much on a grinder it'll be a sound investment. Spend a bit more time reading the coffee forums, there is good reason why La Pav Euro/Pros are never recommended but if you insist the Pro has a bigger boiler and pressure gauge which is very useful.
Click to expand...

Thanks so the grinder I'm is good.

The pavoni's you are dropping hints that they are hard to to get consistent results that has peaked my interest even more :) I like a challenge.
I also like the idea that it's possible to have results from good to bad and I have greater control I want to use what I make in cooking tiramisu springs to mind

I think your are right about choosing the pro over the euro. Bigger boiler will give better thermal stability and a pressure gauge will help with consistency, so I always have it at the same pressure before pulling a shot.

So last question what do you think about the Stradivari vs the Euros?
 
If it's your first non BTC machine, I think I read that right, the Lever is a big ask but good luck with it; these tend to become very trendy ornaments but if you keep at it you will succeed just don't become too disheartened. As Tony said consistence is the key and there's much to consider besides the hardware (BTW, at this price point MC2 - forget the Kitchenaid): store your coffee correctly, only grind what you need, with fluctuations in ambient temp and humidity don't expect the grinder setting to produce the God shot it did an hour earlier, clean your group-head, descale regularly.

Most importantly, enjoy your coffee journey.
 
YorkNeil said:
If it's your first non BTC machine, I think I read that right, the Lever is a big ask but good luck with it; these tend to become very trendy ornaments but if you keep at it you will succeed just don't become too disheartened. As Tony said consistence is the key and there's much to consider besides the hardware (BTW, at this price point MC2 - forget the Kitchenaid): store your coffee correctly, only grind what you need, with fluctuations in ambient temp and humidity don't expect the grinder setting to produce the God shot it did an hour earlier, clean your group-head, descale regularly.

Most importantly, enjoy your coffee journey.
Click to expand...

Thanks.

It sounds more fun then just pushing a button. Nothing mentioned there that cannot be fixed. it will give me stuff to tinker with.
 
barlines said:
Ratty said:
My Gaggia Titanium Died tonight - I sense a big bill coming

Ratty
Click to expand...

which bit - steam knob leaking?
Click to expand...

The grinder whirrs faster than usual no beans seem to be getting to it - disassembled and cleaned the grinder - but same thing - after 20 or seconds occur it cuts out and displays that the (full) hopper needs filling with beans.
Did everything rigorously as per this YouTube vid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0aApA_Lw9I

:-( I miss my strong lattes

Ratty
 
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