Class discrimination.

We are all plebs - just a lot of us don't know it! Originally, it meant free, land owning Romans (Tory) and now means those of a lower social class (Labour). What the copper knew was that it does not include ex-Public School boys, in their opinion.
 
Fido said:
I must stop looking at the front pages in the Newsagents.

Can anyone explain to me why it is so offensive to call someone a pleb, yet fair game to attack someone for being a toff?
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The press just like attacking politicians wherever they can, it's the nature of the press in this country.

You would never see a headline like.

"UK escapes deepest recession crisis thanks to early austerity measures brought in by government"

That just wouldn't do at all for our press, even though it is quite close to the truth.

Personally I think anybody in a reasonably well paid job, or with a huge amount of responsibility should travel Business Class or First class. I travel on the Virgin West Coast Main Line a lot, and always in First Class as it makes sound business sense. It costs a few quid more, but while on the train I am able to actually work.

When sitting in First Class you are guaranteed some space, and a table with power and Wi Fi so you can connect your laptop and do some work. If you travel in economy you are sometimes lucky to even get a seat.
 
Did he call them plebs? Did he lie or did the cops lie? If it was the police they would have lost their jobs I'm sure and quite rightly.
He still refuses to say exactly what he did say. If he had sincerely apologised to the officers and offered a handshake I think and hope that would have been the end of the matter.
I believe he tried to enter the same gate afterwards and was denied access. I'm afraid the former Chief Whip did come across as arrogant throughout this whole episode.
It does seems a shame to lose your job because of ego.
 
Re: RE: Class discrimination.

Lose the beard said:
Personally I think anybody in a reasonably well paid job, or with a huge amount of responsibility should travel Business Class or First class. I travel on the Virgin West Coast Main Line a lot, and always in First Class as it makes sound business sense. It costs a few quid more, but while on the train I am able to actually work.

When sitting in First Class you are guaranteed some space, and a table with power and Wi Fi so you can connect your laptop and do some work. If you travel in economy you are sometimes lucky to even get a seat.
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And you don't have to suffer those tiresome plebs. Imagine having to sit next to someone without a huge amount of responsibility or a reasonably large income. [Shudder]
 
How did the matter get any attention? Should the police offer just have ignored it, like police officers must do all day every day in every part of the country? Did the police federation not see it as an opportunity to attack the government and get one up on them?

If he called him a pleb then so be it, it means he's human. He's a government minister and some jobs worth copper gets in his road, it's only natural to mouth off. It isn't wise or right, but it's not a big deal.

The populist press and moronic masses of this country are obsessed with train tickets, plebs and other trivial matters while they vote for the leader they dislike the least. Our democracy is a laughing stock because it's what we deserve, because we're too vapid and vain to demand better.
 
Pleb is a derogatory term as it implies a lack of integrity. I don't know a word for ruling upper class and lack of integrity so it must mean they are born with it.
 
I don't understand it to imply that, I understand it to mean someone who is common or unimportant. An observation in this case which was true.
 
Re: RE: Class discrimination.

Halk said:
I don't understand it to imply that, I understand it to mean someone who is common or unimportant. An observation in this case which was true.
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I would like to think that nobody was unimportant.
 
Dr Rick said:
Halk said:
I don't understand it to imply that, I understand it to mean someone who is common or unimportant. An observation in this case which was true.
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I would like to think that nobody was unimportant.
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Importance is always relative, so most people are unimportant to most of us. In the context that he's accused of using it the police officer certainly is relatively unimportant.

I'm not meaning to defend him, but don't agree with glib comments like yours, and I think the whole incident is entirely unremarkable, except when people use it as a weapon in class warfare.

antdad said:
An observation from who's perspective?
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One is a minister of the government which runs the country, the other is a police officer guarding a door. It's a relative measure.
 
If he called him a pleb then so be it, it means he's human. He's a government minister and some jobs worth copper gets in his road, it's only natural to mouth off. It isn't wise or right, but it's not a big deal.

Halk if you witnessed a drunk or a chav calling a police officer a pleb and swearing at them, telling them to 'eff off etc, what would you expect the officer to do? If you and I had swore at an officer and verbally abused them would we or should we be arrested?
 
rangers62 said:
If he called him a pleb then so be it, it means he's human. He's a government minister and some jobs worth copper gets in his road, it's only natural to mouth off. It isn't wise or right, but it's not a big deal.

If you witnessed a drunk or a chav calling a police officer a pleb and swearing at them, telling them to 'eff off etc, what would you expect the officer to do? If you and I had swore at an officer and verbally abused them would we or should we be arrested?
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I don't know that that was verbal abuse. It seems to me that the police officer was being obstructive (rightly or wrongly) and Mitchell made some ill advised comments (which nobody supports) and walked away.

I'm not a police officer, but I do get sworn at by people at work from time to time, and it's water off a duck's back and part of the job. Their behaviour is not right, but it doesn't warrant the level of press attention or the loss of a job.

A similar incident. Someone at work spent a night in the cells when a police officer stopped and asked him if he was [famous actor]. For a laugh he said he was, the police officer asked to see ID, and he said he was only joking. He wasn't aggressive or offensive about it, the police officer just didn't like being made to look foolish so put him in the cells overnight. Nobody I know, including police officers, believes this was proportionate or reasonable and believes the police officer abused their powers to come out on top.

At work in the staff restaurant a senior member of staff was waiting to be served and was ignored by the person serving for a few minutes while she cleaned up a spill. The member of staff walked off in the huff after laying down what she had intended to buy and having a petulant go at the restaurant staff. Yes, I thought she was an arse for doing it, but no I don't think she should have been hounded to resign.

What happened here was an MP made a mistake, and the country leapt at the chance to hate someone for a few days. It happens more and more often now. Anyone who has read 1984 may see some similarity.

It's far worse, in my opinion, that this reached the public. It's much worse that the police breach confidentiality than an MP has a petulant outburst.
 
I know a few people who have had personal dealings with Andrew Mitchell.

Every one of them - to man - said he was an utter bell-end.

I have seen nothing to make me question their opinion of him.

His 'do you know who I am?' attitude might work on pencil-necked, limp-wristed, public-school backbenches in Parliament but not on a riot-hardened Dibble in London. I'd have left the soft fat prat in a puddle of his own piss trying to work out how to remove an ASP with two broken elbows.

Phew. I don't often do 'political' but this is rather fun.
 
I can't, and won't disagree with your summary of him - because I think you're probably right.

However do you think it's a healthy democracy where we hate MPs to the degree that when any step out of line we have a witch hunt?

Should we pick MPs purely on how physically attractive, patronising, ill-offensive and down to earth they are? I've nothing good to say about Mitchell but I think this populist kangaroo court is far more worrying.
 
I suspect 'hoist by his own petard' is apt for Mitchell - and folk are having some serious fun at his expense, Seems an arrogant pillock has got his come-uppance - which is fine by me as he's a privileged pillock.
 
Politics does seem to have become a profession so loathed that only the moderately loathsome are willing to go into it. Which is probably not healthy, and is certainly circular.

Of course the delayed resignation here was driven by the need for a story to distract from George O sitting in the wrong carriage for his ticket... life imitating The Thick Of It again! Ironically, Mitchell has been thrown under the bus for somebody actually important.
 
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