New to DE shaving - Can't get a close shave

P

Profcool

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Hi all, I'm brand new to DE shaving and new to this forum. Just looking for some advice. So I had my second ever shave using a DE razor this morning and to be honest I'm struggling so looking for some hints and tips, do's and don't etc. Other than the shave cream, I bought my kit from Executive Shaving choosing items from their beginners range and my setup is....

Timor Closed Comb Safety Razor
Personna blades
Executive Shaving pre shave oil
Acqua Di Parma shave cream

For reference I have used Gillettes all my life and currently use the Fusion. For all the pluses and minuses with cartridges, I can safely say it gives an excellent very close shave with no nicks or cuts. So why am I changing? Just because it's an itch I have and I want to scratch it! Interested to see what shaving with a DE is like.

So the first problem I am having is that the shave really isn't close. I was under the impression that DE razors could give you a nice close shave but I am not getting it. Don't get me wrong, visibly I look clean shaven but running my hand over my face and I can feel roughness. My approach was 3 passes, first with the grain, second across the grain and third with the grain again. I'm not sure if you can go against the grain with a DE but I have never shaved this way with a cartridge so for now haven't done this. I had read not to apply pressure when shaving with a DE and to let the razor do the work, which is what I have done, but I wonder if I could be applying a little more pressure to get more closeness?

Second problem is that I am getting lots of nicks and cuts. I always expected DE's to be more risky when it comes to nicks and cuts but was surprised at how many I got considering I bought what I thought were fairly forgiving blades. Is this to be expected for a newbie and is it 'practise makes perfect'?

Finally it feels like sometimes the razor is passing over the skin, removing the lather but not taking any hairs with it. This could just be a perception thing but I'm thinking I'm not getting the angle of the head right. Cartridges are naturally angled in a way that you don't have to think about it but I wondering how exact you need to be with the 30 degree angle of blade to skin? Going down my face seems fine but I seem to be struggling going up my neck and across my face. Could blade angle be contributing to both the closeness and the cuts that I'm getting?

I am guessing that for now I need to persevere and over time the technique will get better but interested in any advice you can give!
 
Welcome to the forum @Profcool.
I am sure you will get a lot of advice on the forum.
When I got back into wet shaving my muscle memory took over so I did not really have any issues, although I will say my technique has improved.
Razor and blade combinations are very much YMMV (your mileage may vary), as is razor angle, it's a case of trial and error.
Try riding the cap with the razor angle open then slowly close the angle until you can feel it cutting, dont chase BBS from the off until your face/skin becomes accustomed to the new routine.
No pressure at all is required, in fact you mentioned that sometimes it feels as if the razor is not cutting, this could be your correct angle if it is removing stubble. It's about gently taking the soap off while removing the stubble. Also beard strength will play a part.
Perseverance is the key. For me it is no longer a chore but a part of the day I really look forward to, a bit of me time.
Welcome to the rabbit hole of pogonotomy take your time and enjoy.
T
 
Profcool said:
Hi all, I'm brand new to DE shaving and new to this forum. Just looking for some advice. So I had my second ever shave using a DE razor this morning and to be honest I'm struggling so looking for some hints and tips, do's and don't etc. Other than the shave cream, I bought my kit from Executive Shaving choosing items from their beginners range and my setup is....

Timor Closed Comb Safety Razor
Personna blades
Executive Shaving pre shave oil
Acqua Di Parma shave cream

For reference I have used Gillettes all my life and currently use the Fusion. For all the pluses and minuses with cartridges, I can safely say it gives an excellent very close shave with no nicks or cuts. So why am I changing? Just because it's an itch I have and I want to scratch it! Interested to see what shaving with a DE is like.

So the first problem I am having is that the shave really isn't close. I was under the impression that DE razors could give you a nice close shave but I am not getting it. Don't get me wrong, visibly I look clean shaven but running my hand over my face and I can feel roughness. My approach was 3 passes, first with the grain, second across the grain and third with the grain again. I'm not sure if you can go against the
grain with a DE but I have never shaved this way with a cartridge so for now haven't done this. I had read not to apply pressure when shaving with a DE and to let the razor do the work, which is what I have done, but I wonder if I could be applying a little more pressure to get more closeness?

Second problem is that I am getting lots of nicks and cuts. I always expected DE's to be more risky when it comes to nicks and cuts but was surprised at how many I got considering I bought what I thought were fairly forgiving blades. Is this to be expected for a newbie and is it 'practise makes perfect'?

Finally it feels like sometimes the razor is passing over the skin, removing the lather but not taking any hairs with it. This could just be a perception thing but I'm thinking I'm not getting the angle of the head right. Cartridges are naturally angled in a way that you don't have to think about it but I wondering how exact you need to be with the 30 degree angle of blade to skin? Going down my face seems fine but I seem to be struggling going up my neck and across my face. Could blade angle be contributing to both the closeness and the cuts that I'm getting?

I am guessing that for now I need to persevere and over time the technique will get better but interested in any advice you can give!
Click to expand...
Hello and welcome to the forum.
Most of what I wa going to say was covered by the first reply you had but an important thing you need to find out is in which directions your beard grows.
You say you shave with, across and against the grain and a lot of men think this is down, sideways and up, it may be but untill you know in what directions your beard grows you won't know if you are shaving in the most effective manner.
When you have got a days growth take a cotton wool ball and gently pass this over your stubble taking note where it is snagging, this will give you the direction of growth and you do this all over your beard area untill you have a beard map of growth direction for you, we are all different.
Once you know this then you can shave with, across and against the direction of growth knowing you are shaving in an effective manner.
I shave down, across up and then on the diagonal in order to get a clean shave, it's just the way my beard grows in places.
As has been said already, no pressure is needed when shaving just let the weight of the razor do the work for you.
Remember your beard map and shave effectively with no pressure, ubove all relax and try to take your time to enjoy your shave.
Let us know how you get on.

Paul.
 
Profcool said:
Hi all, I'm brand new to DE shaving and new to this forum. Just looking for some advice. So I had my second ever shave using a DE razor this morning and to be honest I'm struggling so looking for some hints and tips, do's and don't etc. Other than the shave cream, I bought my kit from Executive Shaving choosing items from their beginners range and my setup is....

Timor Closed Comb Safety Razor
Personna blades
Executive Shaving pre shave oil
Acqua Di Parma shave cream

For reference I have used Gillettes all my life and currently use the Fusion. For all the pluses and minuses with cartridges, I can safely say it gives an excellent very close shave with no nicks or cuts. So why am I changing? Just because it's an itch I have and I want to scratch it! Interested to see what shaving with a DE is like.

So the first problem I am having is that the shave really isn't close. I was under the impression that DE razors could give you a nice close shave but I am not getting it. Don't get me wrong, visibly I look clean shaven but running my hand over my face and I can feel roughness. My approach was 3 passes, first with the grain, second across the grain and third with the grain again. I'm not sure if you can go against the grain with a DE but I have never shaved this way with a cartridge so for now haven't done this. I had read not to apply pressure when shaving with a DE and to let the razor do the work, which is what I have done, but I wonder if I could be applying a little more pressure to get more closeness?

Second problem is that I am getting lots of nicks and cuts. I always expected DE's to be more risky when it comes to nicks and cuts but was surprised at how many I got considering I bought what I thought were fairly forgiving blades. Is this to be expected for a newbie and is it 'practise makes perfect'?

Finally it feels like sometimes the razor is passing over the skin, removing the lather but not taking any hairs with it. This could just be a perception thing but I'm thinking I'm not getting the angle of the head right. Cartridges are naturally angled in a way that you don't have to think about it but I wondering how exact you need to be with the 30 degree angle of blade to skin? Going down my face seems fine but I seem to be struggling going up my neck and across my face. Could blade angle be contributing to both the closeness and the cuts that I'm getting?

I am guessing that for now I need to persevere and over time the technique will get better but interested in any advice you can give!
Click to expand...
Hello mate - and welcome - I would hesitate to give any direct advice - our faces are all unique - but some things I learned when moving away from using cartridge razors -

You are not going to get it right first or second time - it takes practice and experience - the longer you do it - the better you will become at it. Essentially - you are re-learning how to shave. Pay attention to your preparation - ready your beard for being cut comfortably - there are many approaches - but it really comes down to making sure your whiskers are properly clean and hydrated - learn how your beard grows in - when you have a couple of day's growth - rub your fingers against it - to understand the direction it grows - it is seldom regular - and pay attention to this. Yes you can shave against the grain - but it is the hardest pass to master. Don't obsess about razor angles - hold it flat against your face and turn the handle upwards until you start to hear it cut - listen to the noise the razor makes as it works - as good a guide as any. Don't use pressure - this is very important. You will get a few weepers - slight cuts - as you learn - get an alum block - it will stem the blood - but also is a good learning tool - if it stings when you apply it - then you have been too heavy handed. You - to a large extent answer your own question - 'practice makes perfect.' Stick with it - it takes time - I found. As the man above said - don't chase bbs - relax - your muscle memory will soon kick in - you end up not thinking about it - I used to dread shaving - but not any more. It is well worth the effort - I found - a very positive ritual in my life - and you get to smell nice! What's not to like? - yours - I.
 
Last edited:
Profcool said:
Hi all, I'm brand new to DE shaving and new to this forum. Just looking for some advice. So I had my second ever shave using a DE razor this morning and to be honest I'm struggling so looking for some hints and tips, do's and don't etc. Other than the shave cream, I bought my kit from Executive Shaving choosing items from their beginners range and my setup is....

Timor Closed Comb Safety Razor
Personna blades
Executive Shaving pre shave oil
Acqua Di Parma shave cream

For reference I have used Gillettes all my life and currently use the Fusion. For all the pluses and minuses with cartridges, I can safely say it gives an excellent very close shave with no nicks or cuts. So why am I changing? Just because it's an itch I have and I want to scratch it! Interested to see what shaving with a DE is like.

So the first problem I am having is that the shave really isn't close. I was under the impression that DE razors could give you a nice close shave but I am not getting it. Don't get me wrong, visibly I look clean shaven but running my hand over my face and I can feel roughness. My approach was 3 passes, first with the grain, second across the grain and third with the grain again. I'm not sure if you can go against the grain with a DE but I have never shaved this way with a cartridge so for now haven't done this. I had read not to apply pressure when shaving with a DE and to let the razor do the work, which is what I have done, but I wonder if I could be applying a little more pressure to get more closeness?

Second problem is that I am getting lots of nicks and cuts. I always expected DE's to be more risky when it comes to nicks and cuts but was surprised at how many I got considering I bought what I thought were fairly forgiving blades. Is this to be expected for a newbie and is it 'practise makes perfect'?

Finally it feels like sometimes the razor is passing over the skin, removing the lather but not taking any hairs with it. This could just be a perception thing but I'm thinking I'm not getting the angle of the head right. Cartridges are naturally angled in a way that you don't have to think about it but I wondering how exact you need to be with the 30 degree angle of blade to skin? Going down my face seems fine but I seem to be struggling going up my neck and across my face. Could blade angle be contributing to both the closeness and the cuts that I'm getting?

I am guessing that for now I need to persevere and over time the technique will get better but interested in any advice you can give!
Click to expand...

I don't know the razor but most of beginners are advised to start with EJ89, Muhle R89 or Merkur 34C, having said that, I'd recommend beginers to start with the Rockwell 6c, because it can start at a very mild level and you can find your level of aggressiveness that works for you.

You need to develop your technique and that takes a bit of time.
You need to find the blade that works for you with your chosen razor, this is mostly trial and error, you can buy multiblade packs but likely that 90% of those blades aren't popular with shavers and that is no coincidence. So read about what are the most popular blades amongst experience shavers. For me: Permarsharp, Gillette Silver Blue, Nacet, Voskhood, Personna Lab Blue, etc.
You need to learn to map the growth of your beard so you understand what is with the grain (WTG) Across the grain (XTG) and Against the Grain (ATG) for your facial hair.
Take your time, no pressure and you will get there.

Good luck.
 
Welcome to B&B.
Profcool said:
Finally it feels like sometimes the razor is passing over the skin, removing the lather but not taking any hairs with it. This could just be a perception thing but I'm thinking I'm not getting the angle of the head right.
Click to expand...
It sounds like your blade angle is off and working on your technique takes a little time. The shave with the DE is gradual stubble reduction and do not use pressure and force the blade. Three passes is normal for a very close shave and against the grain is usually needed to get close on the final pass.
These illustrations may help you with blade angle. The tendency when changing from a cartridge razor to the DE razor is to shave at too steep a blade angle. The most effective blade angle is when the razor cap and safety bar are in equal contact with the skin, called the design or neutral angle; around 30 degrees. I am not familiar with the Timor razor but it seems to be a 3 piece razor and not too aggressive.
shallow angle.jpgsteep angle.jpg
 
You seem to have a good kit to start with, you didn't mention a shaving brush.

As a few others have suggested, pay attention to your lather and skin preparation. Making sure your face is prepared is half the battle. 2-3 mins is suggested to make sure your face is hydrated properly. Usually shaving after a shower helps.
Regarding the shave angle it's not always 30º. Some are less, others more. You can usually see in the mirror when doing the side of your face when the blade is in contact with your skin. Too large an angle you'll be riding the cap, too little, just scrapping the lather with the guard.
 
welcome ;) as above have provided great advise, i just add this rome wasn,t built in a day it take time & experience to build muscle memory & techique ,there,s the 30 day rule ,use 1 soap 1 razor 1 blade for 30 days or 30 shaves learn how to use the gear you have ........ if its not up to your standards there,s no rules to say you can,t run over with your cart razor for your last pass to get what you feel is acceptable , don,t rush it build a good foundation & build on that !!!! but most of all do what works for you !!!!!! stick with it you will figure it out :p
 
Welcome - most of us will have had the same or similar experiences and eventually will produce passable results. Remember, it's beard reduction not elimination so chasing the last whisker will not produce any benefit. It's also very difficult to discuss this in writing without seeing how you actually prep and shave.

As "doughnut" said stick with a combination of gear for a prolonged time until you believe you are happy with the results. I see so many discussions here and elsewhere about which blade to use, which razor, which soap, etc etc but with constant changing you won't actually know where you are going wrong. Quality of shaving supplies is very high and I'm not sure how much is down to technique vs.materials.
 
Welcome along @Profcool

All of the advice given is very valid

I will only add one or two suggestions

Only shave when you need to (when you have sufficient growth to remove)
If you usually shave every other day with cartridge razors, then follow your usual pattern.
As you will know, cartridge razors can be very forgiving, mostly due to the small amount of blade exposure. DE razors allow in most cases, a fair amount of blade exposure/blade feel. This is in fact not only removing the stubble, but also a layer of skin too. (This is why alcohol aftershaves sting)

Try only two passes, WTG & XTG.
As your technique improves, you will find that you get better results.
Some members on this forum do two WTG passes only, and get acceptable results.
It's nice to get a BBS finish, but let's face it, you'll shave again tomorrow or the day after, so you'll only be that smooth for a short time anyway.

Your technique will improve over time, but it's all a learning curve - it is definitely worth persevering, and the sense of accomplishment is also very rewarding.

One final word . . . There's no such thing as a stupid question here - we've all been there, and are happy to help/advise if we can.

One final, final word . . . Stay away from the Buy, Sell, Trade section on online shaving forums - it's like a bloody cyclone i tell you !
 
Merkurologist said:
I don't know the razor but most of beginners are advised to start with EJ89, Muhle R89 or Merkur 34C, having said that, I'd recommend beginers to start with the Rockwell 6c, because it can start at a very mild level and you can find your level of aggressiveness that works for you.
Click to expand...

I previously purchased a Timor razor - no idea if the same model as yours. I purchased as the box may have been made in Solingen Germany - no idea on the razor's country of origin. I found the efficiency of the razor to be close to the same with or without a blade. A few attempts and binned.

Read the above quote !
 
Batch300 said:
I previously purchased a Timor razor - no idea if the same model as yours. I purchased as the box may have been made in Solingen Germany - no idea on the razor's country of origin. I found the efficiency of the razor to be close to the same with or without a blade. A few attempts and binned.

Read the above quote !
Click to expand...
I think you are confusing me, I don't own a Timor razor, in fact, I had not heard of it before I read this thread.

Why would anyone recommend something so mild when there a 3 well known razors for beginners ?
 
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