shaving expert please!/shaving while in the shower

[TobyC]

Again, what you're saying is true, I guess. But rubbish nonetheless. Most people find the extra lubrication from lather provides a better shave. Which it does.
Kinda seems like you might only be able to make simple deductions...

 

[TobyC]

No one complains their face becomes TOO slippery when using soap.

When choosing a soap, slippery is a selling point, not a deal breaker.

.

 

[G_man]

I also agree that what @Len is saying is technically true, just not in the context of shaving!

You would always want maximum glide possible. Your don't need control in terms of handling the DE. You don't have to make quick stops and turns.
If you don't have slippery skin (to the maximum extent), you will create a bump or a ridge in the skin right before the blade (due to drag). And this ridge is the same deal as having an improper angle of the razor - the blade will scrape the skin rather than cut the hair and glide over the skin (which would be the case with taut/slippery skin). You would inevitably damage the outer layer of the skin.

I thought this was already established science?

Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk

 

[Dansco]

I also agree that what @Len is saying is technically true, just not in the context of shaving!

You would always want maximum glide possible. Your don't need control in terms of handling the DE. You don't have to make quick stops and turns.
If you don't have slippery skin (to the maximum extent), you will create a bump or a ridge in the skin right before the blade (due to drag). And this ridge is the same deal as having an improper angle of the razor - the blade will scrape the skin rather than cut the hair and glide over the skin (which would be the case with taut/slippery skin). You would inevitably damage the outer layer of the skin.

I thought this was already established science?

Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk

It is

 

[TobyC]

I also agree that what @Len is saying is technically true, just not in the context of shaving!

You would always want maximum glide possible. Your don't need control in terms of handling the DE. You don't have to make quick stops and turns.
If you don't have slippery skin (to the maximum extent), you will create a bump or a ridge in the skin right before the blade (due to drag). And this ridge is the same deal as having an improper angle of the razor - the blade will scrape the skin rather than cut the hair and glide over the skin (which would be the case with taut/slippery skin). You would inevitably damage the outer layer of the skin.

I thought this was already established science?

Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk

It is.

 

[Len]

Kinda seems like you might only be able to make simple deductions...

Perhaps, perhaps not, but is that not better than those here able to make no deductions, or others deducting something is better than that which they have never tried?

As you mention, some "slipperiness" is required for a proper glide. I would argue the optimum lubrication is provided by soap, not water.

You would argue based on what? Your use of water only at the sink, or water only in the shower, compared to soap? Or argue what is based only in your imagination as a comparison?

My argument is based on experience using all of the above, then theorizing why my best results are as they are.

Do you have a better explanation for my results, or the results of the OP?

Water on its own is usable - some people do shave without soap - but its not the norm. Most people find the extra lubrication from lather provides a better shave. Which it does.

"Most people" don't know the difference, for never having tried. Though, if you were to argue that a lather shave at the sink provides a better shave than a lather-less shave at the sink, I would agree.

The slipperiness between the face and the blade however, is usually considered a bonus.

No one complains their face becomes TOO slippery when using soap.

Again, at the sink, I would agree, but not in the shower. But people not complaining about a comparison they've never tried is hardly proof of anything.

I also agree that what @Len is saying is technically true, just not in the context of shaving!

You would always want maximum glide possible. Your don't need control in terms of handling the DE. You don't have to make quick stops and turns.
If you don't have slippery skin (to the maximum extent), you will create a bump or a ridge in the skin right before the blade (due to drag). And this ridge is the same deal as having an improper angle of the razor - the blade will scrape the skin rather than cut the hair and glide over the skin (which would be the case with taut/slippery skin). You would inevitably damage the outer layer of the skin.

I thought this was already established science?

There may be specific cases where a lathered shave is preferable to a lather-less shower shave. Specific hair and skin type might call for it, for example. Using a straight razor might make a lathered shave more optimal.

In my case, I always chase the closest possible BBS shave. The vast majority of people are fine with a DFS. If a DFS was good enough for me, I would agree with you, and stick almost exclusively with lather. The reason lather can be easier, especially when going for your typical DFS, is that less sensitivity is required for feeling the contours and tender points of the face; using the razor as an extension of the hand in one's sense of touch. It's simple really. Find your angle, no pressure, and zip around the face. Done. But going for a BBS... without weepers or irritation... ? That requires very subtle changes of pressure on different areas of the face that one feels by touch. Much of that sense of touch is lost when using a buffer like lather, and the glide is so slick that those subtle changes are more difficult to make accurately.

See, you are speaking of bumps, ridges, and drag that can occur when one doesn't have enough glide, and I definitely agree. Shower shaving, at least for me (and others apparently), does provide enough enough glide to prevent blade skipping (bumps, ridges, and drag), but not so much glide that subtle adjustments, and losing some sense of touch, are more difficult when one is chasing the closest possible shave.

I'm willing to accept if I'm wrong about any or all of this. But if I'm wrong, explain my results, or the OP's. Thus far I've read no explanation of these superior results, and what I have read is a critique based on no experience (or even explanation) with what is being criticized.

 

[G_man]

Perhaps, perhaps not, but is that not better than those here able to make no deductions, or others deducting something is better than that which they have never tried?



You would argue based on what? Your use of water only at the sink, or water only in the shower, compared to soap? Or argue what is based only in your imagination as a comparison?

My argument is based on experience using all of the above, then theorizing why my best results are as they are.

Do you have a better explanation for my results, or the results of the OP?



"Most people" don't know the difference, for never having tried. Though, if you were to argue that a lather shave at the sink provides a better shave than a lather-less shave at the sink, I would agree.



Again, at the sink, I would agree, but not in the shower. But people not complaining about a comparison they've never tried is hardly proof of anything.



There may be specific cases where a lathered shave is preferable to a lather-less shower shave. Specific hair and skin type might call for it, for example. Using a straight razor might make a lathered shave more optimal.

In my case, I always chase the closest possible BBS shave. The vast majority of people are fine with a DFS. If a DFS was good enough for me, I would agree with you, and stick almost exclusively with lather. The reason lather can be easier, especially when going for your typical DFS, is that less sensitivity is required for feeling the contours and tender points of the face; using the razor as an extension of the hand in one's sense of touch. It's simple really. Find your angle, no pressure, and zip around the face. Done. But going for a BBS... without weepers or irritation... ? That requires very subtle changes of pressure on different areas of the face that one feels by touch. Much of that sense of touch is lost when using a buffer like lather, and the glide is so slick that those subtle changes are more difficult to make accurately.

See, you are speaking of bumps, ridges, and drag that can occur when one doesn't have enough glide, and I definitely agree. Shower shaving, at least for me (and others apparently), does provide enough enough glide to prevent blade skipping (bumps, ridges, and drag), but not so much glide that subtle adjustments, and losing some sense of touch, are more difficult when one is chasing the closest possible shave.

I'm willing to accept if I'm wrong about any or all of this. But if I'm wrong, explain my results, or the OP's. Thus far I've read no explanation of these superior results, and what I have read is a critique based on no experience (or even explanation) with what is being criticized.

I have no reason to disbelieve that you are getting great results with this technique. I just can't imagine pulling this off myself. I have rather hard water and using no lather the razor would not only skip, but stop to a halt But to be honest, I've never done it the way you are describing it, under the running shower. I really prefer to shave at the sink.

What I am wandering is where did the OP go?!

 

[Dansco]

I have no reason to disbelieve that you are getting great results with this technique. I just can't imagine pulling this off myself. I have rather hard water and using no lather the razor would not only skip, but stop to a halt But to be honest, I've never done it the way you are describing it, under the running shower. I really prefer to shave at the sink.

What I am wandering is where did the OP go?!

The OP forgot how to access the internet or where he's posted his rants.

No one is saying it would be impossible to shave with only water in the shower. Just less comfortable.

 

[Supermangs]

Good lord.

How did it come to this?

What about having a shower, stepping out, wrapping a towel around you (or not - I don't wanna know) and then shaving immediately. You should be able to do that in less than 10 seconds.

If that doesn't work for you, keep shaving in the shower.

@Len. Some gentle feedback for you. Hopefully it's not your intention, but your tone on this thread seems snarky and sarcastic, verging on disrespectful. That's not what the vibe is here. The vibe is overwhelmingly about positive engagement, largely lighthearted, and with a view to keeping it about sharing views and encouraging others to share theirs without fear of put down. Let's all work to keep it that way. Good man. As you were.

We're talking about shaving here, not saving a generation of children from starvation.

 

[Bogeyman]

I guess I just cannot understand how someone can shave in a shower and use a mirror without water not spraying it to the point of not being able to see anything as well as fogging over. Since water is not a lubricant per se, I cannot understand as well how any man could shave by "feel" and go repeatedly over areas to achieve BBS without getting at minimum grave irritation and worse, ingrown hairs.

Hair does not dry quickly, unless of course you're shaving outdoors in a Saharan oasis and thirty minutes after a shower. Any miniscule amount of hydration lost in the 30 secs. or less to get from the shower to shave basin is recovered instantly upon lathering up. To argue that point as such is simply stupid. After approx. three minutes a beard cannot absorb any more water for that matter. To hammer that point even deeper, lathering a good soap/cream not only moisturizes the beard it is in essence trapping moisture underneath it. You don't need a Ph.D. in fluid dynamics to grasp that nugget.

 

[Supermangs]

You don't need a Ph.D. in fluid dynamics to grasp that nugget.

You mean that thesis I've been working on for 3 years is a waste of time?

 

[TobyC]

Perhaps, perhaps not, but is that not better than those here able to make no deductions, or others deducting something is better than that which they have never tried?



You would argue based on what? Your use of water only at the sink, or water only in the shower, compared to soap? Or argue what is based only in your imagination as a comparison?

My argument is based on experience using all of the above, then theorizing why my best results are as they are.

Do you have a better explanation for my results, or the results of the OP?



"Most people" don't know the difference, for never having tried. Though, if you were to argue that a lather shave at the sink provides a better shave than a lather-less shave at the sink, I would agree.



Again, at the sink, I would agree, but not in the shower. But people not complaining about a comparison they've never tried is hardly proof of anything.



There may be specific cases where a lathered shave is preferable to a lather-less shower shave. Specific hair and skin type might call for it, for example. Using a straight razor might make a lathered shave more optimal.

In my case, I always chase the closest possible BBS shave. The vast majority of people are fine with a DFS. If a DFS was good enough for me, I would agree with you, and stick almost exclusively with lather. The reason lather can be easier, especially when going for your typical DFS, is that less sensitivity is required for feeling the contours and tender points of the face; using the razor as an extension of the hand in one's sense of touch. It's simple really. Find your angle, no pressure, and zip around the face. Done. But going for a BBS... without weepers or irritation... ? That requires very subtle changes of pressure on different areas of the face that one feels by touch. Much of that sense of touch is lost when using a buffer like lather, and the glide is so slick that those subtle changes are more difficult to make accurately.

See, you are speaking of bumps, ridges, and drag that can occur when one doesn't have enough glide, and I definitely agree. Shower shaving, at least for me (and others apparently), does provide enough enough glide to prevent blade skipping (bumps, ridges, and drag), but not so much glide that subtle adjustments, and losing some sense of touch, are more difficult when one is chasing the closest possible shave.

I'm willing to accept if I'm wrong about any or all of this. But if I'm wrong, explain my results, or the OP's. Thus far I've read no explanation of these superior results, and what I have read is a critique based on no experience (or even explanation) with what is being criticized.

God complex;

A psychosis based in uncontrolled narcissism, inflated arrogance and a perceived need to subjugate and/or ridicule other individuals deemed to be inferior or unworthy.

.

 

[Len]

@Len. Some gentle feedback for you. Hopefully it's not your intention, but your tone on this thread seems snarky and sarcastic, verging on disrespectful. That's not what the vibe is here. The vibe is overwhelmingly about positive engagement, largely lighthearted, and with a view to keeping it about sharing views and encouraging others to share theirs without fear of put down. Let's all work to keep it that way. Good man. As you were.

Apologies to the innocent. Any 'snarky-ness' was applied and meant for those who were first disrespectful to me and my technique. If someone wants to throw a jab, I'm more than happy to return a left hook.

I guess I just cannot understand how someone can shave in a shower and use a mirror without water not spraying it to the point of not being able to see anything as well as fogging over.

Who said anything about using a mirror? Sense of touch, especially and specifically in something like shaving, IME, is vastly more useful than sight. A mirror would actually be a distraction to this sense with my technique.

Since water is not a lubricant per se, I cannot understand as well how any man could shave by "feel" and go repeatedly over areas to achieve BBS without getting at minimum grave irritation and worse, ingrown hairs.

Hair does not dry quickly, unless of course you're shaving outdoors in a Saharan oasis and thirty minutes after a shower. Any miniscule amount of hydration lost in the 30 secs. or less to get from the shower to shave basin is recovered instantly upon lathering up. To argue that point as such is simply stupid. After approx. three minutes a beard cannot absorb any more water for that matter. To hammer that point even deeper, lathering a good soap/cream not only moisturizes the beard it is in essence trapping moisture underneath it. You don't need a Ph.D. in fluid dynamics to grasp that nugget.

Water IS a lubricant, though not as lubricating as a soap or cream. One needs more of a lubrication that is not as lubricating to do the job proper. Lubrication in my case is a matter of not too much, not too little, but just right. And to repeat, I'm not lathering.

God complex;

A psychosis based in uncontrolled narcissism, inflated arrogance and a perceived need to subjugate and/or ridicule other individuals deemed to be inferior or unworthy.

You continue to insult without adding to the discussion or debate. Doing such is called being a "troll". Might want to look that one up.

 

[dave79]

<gets popcorn>

 

[TobyC]

Apologies to the innocent. Any 'snarky-ness' was applied and meant for those who were first disrespectful to me and my technique. If someone wants to throw a jab, I'm more than happy to return a left hook.



Who said anything about using a mirror? Sense of touch, especially and specifically in something like shaving, IME, is vastly more useful than sight. A mirror would actually be a distraction to this sense with my technique.



Water IS a lubricant, though not as lubricating as a soap or cream. One needs more of a lubrication that is not as lubricating to do the job proper. And to repeat, I'm not lathering.



You continue to insult without adding to the discussion or debate. Doing such is called being a "troll". Might want to look that one up.

You're not here for discussion or debate, you're here to tell everyone that you are right, and you become indignant when someone else has an opinion. You don't want to take part in a conversation, you want to be the only voice in the room.

 

[Len]

You're not here for discussion or debate, you're here to tell everyone that you are right, and you become indignant when someone else has an opinion. You don't want to take part in a conversation, you want to be the only voice in the room.

I'm practically the only one representing a style of shaving that no one else responding does. If someone else has experience with this style, I'd step down to let them speak. It's like being the only married man in a room full of virgins, debating and explaining that having sex requires the clothes off.

Neither do I comment authoritatively on topics of which I'm ignorant. On those, I read and listen quietly and learn, speaking up only if I have questions.