The Shave Den
- Thread starter hando
- Start Date
- Joined
- Wednesday September 23, 2009
- Location
- Almere, Netherlands
Not to be a party pooper, but borax and boric acid derivatives are highly restricted in cosmetics in Europe... in soaps the maximum allowed concentration is 3%. FYI.
- Joined
- Friday July 10, 2009
- Location
- Little Feckwittering-on-the-Moor
Our EU overlords have banned borax from sale - probably lobbied by the Sodium Sesquicarbonate Manufacturers' Association to do it... so no more primary school kids making slime 
It's only been used for 200 years without too many people dying irresponsibly when using it... I'd love to know why it's banned.
It's only been used for 200 years without too many people dying irresponsibly when using it... I'd love to know why it's banned.
- Joined
- Wednesday September 23, 2009
- Location
- Almere, Netherlands
I think the main reason is that it is a suspected developmental toxicant. And of course as authorities you can't depend on the responsibility of individual citizens to use chemicals wisely, not in this risk-less society...
- Joined
- Friday July 10, 2009
- Location
- Little Feckwittering-on-the-Moor
So banned on a "suspicion" - lovely. Sets a precedent for all those filesharers out there to be banned on suspicion of sharing a file.
- Joined
- Wednesday September 23, 2009
- Location
- Almere, Netherlands
Sure, but in toxicology suspicion is a little more well defined than that; although with the precautionary principle creeping its way in every nook and cranny of the EU regulatory bodies, you'd never know it.
A suspected carcinogen is a substance that can cause cancer in experimental animals but for which there are no indication that it causes cancer in humans (which means that actually there is positive evidence (exposure but no cancer) rather than negative (no exposure, so we have no idea).
Same with a suspected developmental toxicant - enough evidence to label it, not enough to decide that it is a definite developmental toxicant in humans.
Such substances can be declassified though; if there is enough evidence that shows that the effect, although seen in animals, will not, or only under very special circumstances occur in humans.
A simple and not uncommon example is certain kidney effects in (male) rats. A fair number of substances can trigger these, but the effect is specific to rats, so this finding nowadays has no effect on the hazard and risk assessment for humans.
Henk
A suspected carcinogen is a substance that can cause cancer in experimental animals but for which there are no indication that it causes cancer in humans (which means that actually there is positive evidence (exposure but no cancer) rather than negative (no exposure, so we have no idea).
Same with a suspected developmental toxicant - enough evidence to label it, not enough to decide that it is a definite developmental toxicant in humans.
Such substances can be declassified though; if there is enough evidence that shows that the effect, although seen in animals, will not, or only under very special circumstances occur in humans.
A simple and not uncommon example is certain kidney effects in (male) rats. A fair number of substances can trigger these, but the effect is specific to rats, so this finding nowadays has no effect on the hazard and risk assessment for humans.
Henk